Is Jacob Prasch Really Under Investigation?

jacob prasch exposed

Graham Baldwin of Catalyst Counselling

 

“…the time is coming that whoever kills you will think that he offers God service.(John 16:2)

In the fall of 2018 David Nathan was dismissed from Moriel Ministries due to heretical teachings that included the affirmation that the blood of animals would atone for sin in the millennium apart from the blood of Christ and that believers can prescriptively anoint clothing with divine power for healing, going so far as to cite examples of people being “slain in the spirit” as a result of touching his jacket and tie quite as a matter of fact. He is on record as saying there will come a time when, “…the blood of Jesus Christ will not profit anyone anything.” There is no possible reality in which this statement is true. It is a demonstrable heresy that denies the gospel and every book of the bible in some way. In the wake of his dismissal, many were confused and upset. One such individual was Graham Baldwin who claims to have began independently “watching” the situation as he is supposedly a cult “expert”. Baldwin has produced a 3-part yellow journalism entry that sounds about as personal as any attack could. This so-called cult “expert” claims that Jacob Prasch is under investigation, but is he really?

 

On Dec. 14, 2018 a new YouTube channel emerged in silence called “Catalyst Counselling”. A mere two days later its first video was published. Over three months passed before the second video emerged which was a sequel to the first, and a third one a month after that. It appears then, that this channel was created for the sole purpose of engaging a particular subject. And, what subject might that be, you ask? Jacob Prasch and Moriel Ministries has been the subject of an ongoing campaign of slander and false witness at the hands of a coalition of disgruntled and otherwise scorned individuals, who (whether they realize it or not) are part of a satanically orchestrated attack fueled by spite and revenge. Before addressing the specific and myriad false claims made by Graham Baldwin in his three-part march of defamation against Jacob Prasch, perhaps providing some context about this individual and his dealings will prove to be most enlightening.

 

Who Is Graham Baldwin?

Graham Baldwin is a man with a past. But aren’t we all? Well, Mr. Baldwin’s past tendencies creep right into his life and actions today, so in some sense, his past is indeed his present. Let’s begin with his organization.

Graham Baldwin is the “Charity Manager and Counsellor” for Catalyst Counselling which has been a registered UK charity since 1995 (according to their website). This organization is ironically one that is lacking organization. The website itself seems to be one wanting in general direction. According to the Catalyst home-page, they are apparently aiming to combat “abusive groups”, “self-styled gurus”, and “bogus paths” that have exploded into the world since WW2 by setting up a residential treatment and training centre, then establishing a training centre (different from the first one), then founding “an advice centre” (whatever that is), followed by setting up a library and research centre. They also plan to respond to “bogus paths” by various and nondescript “training” sessions for teachers, youth workers, etc. Are you confused yet?

catalyst

Graham Baldwin looking busy

This looks something like an essay answer when the child really has no clue what the question was asking. I say that not to be unnecessarily disparaging, but because I cannot think of a better way to describe this aimless mess of a home-page. Please read that last word again. HOME-PAGE. This is the place where they tell the world who they are and what they do and so far I can only see the four centres (that’s right, FOUR) they wish to build. I’m uncertain if they have been aspiring to build this 4-centred complex since 1995 or if this was some ambitious desire that manifested years later. There are very few details to be gleaned from this website other than that they are a registered charity and want to offer some kind of service to aid victims of “bogus paths”; sounds noble. Their “About Us” tab give us this: “to offer help, assistance and counselling to people who have been damaged by religious groups or abusive relationships.” The questions then become, what do we mean by “damaged” and what do we mean by “help”. To ascertain how they intend to “help” let us look a little deeper.

 

GRAHAM BALDWIN & HER MAJESTY’S REVENUE AND CUSTOMS (HMRC)

A central aim, if not the central aim (which they call a “central part”) of this so-called “charity” seems to be summed up in a portion of their “Barnabas Fund” tab which says this:

A central part of our strategy is to purchase a property which will enable us to develop a new and comprehensive response to the problem. In order to do this we need to raise funds to purchase this property.”

Since this was also alluded to on their home-page we can deduce that this is very important to them. Generally speaking, when you hear aimless talk of “help” and “training”, you can be sure you will find a plea for money not far behind. Just how much money are they pleading for? If we slide over to their “How Can You Help” tab we find this doozy of a statement:

We estimate we need £1.5 million to purchase the property, carry out alterations, redecorate and equip it.” (emphasis mine)

This sort of thing is so predictable it would be laughable if it weren’t so disgusting. This, of course, is pleaded for under the guise of helping those who do not have funds to donate so that they might be able to help them with their training against “bogus paths” and so forth. For my American readers, the sum so shamelessly being solicited here is nearly TWO MILLION U.S. dollars. According to a link on their website entitled “Graham’s activity for March 2012” they are:
“…still raising funds for our residential centre,” and ” have monthly donations coming in, which we aim to use for running costs, or could also be put towards a mortgage.”

My burning questions are these: What exactly has been done with the funds being collected for the better part of the last decade? Are these designated funds? They say they “aim to use” the funds for running costs, but my research indicated that there is no record of the Barnabas Project outside of the Catalyst website; no facilities have been built that I can gauge and if they have been, Catalyst Counselling has certainly not apprised their financial supporters via their website. What “running costs” are we then speaking of? For what purpose then have these funds been allocated? How much of this nearly 2 MILLION DOLLAR aim has been reached? Are the funds sitting untouched until the goal is met? Who is in charge of this operation? As acting “Charity Manager and Counsellor” I suppose we can rightly deduce that Mr. Baldwin is in charge of this operation. That’s what “managers” do is it not?

In a 1995 article written by Geraldine Bedelle in which she interviewed Mr. Baldwin personally, we read that,

He is also defensive about funding. His organisation, Catalyst (he employs three people), appears to rely mainly on charitable donations. ‘I don’t think the people and bodies concerned would want you to know who they were,’ he says, ‘basically for a number of reasons.'” (emphasis mine)

In light of this I have another question. Who are the “people and bodies concerned” that wouldn’t “want you to know who they were”? This sounds incredibly dodgy. This article was written during the year of the inception of this so-called “charity” so it seems there is a long history of potentially fraudulent activity as it concerns money. Why was Graham Baldwin so defensive to such a sincere and relevant question?
Given these things, a formal complaint has already been filed with HMRC for review and possible investigation (a real investigation). A copy of this article was also forwarded to them. Since Mr. Baldwin and the Catalyst organization have been soliciting funds for a proposed £1.5 million facility for nearly a decade (if not longer), and this facility has apparently never been built, it would be wise for HMRC to investigate just what these funds have been collected for and just how much has been collected.

 

GRAHAM BALDWIN’S SHADY HISTORY

In late 2018 there were talks of a potential debate between Jacob Prasch and David Nathan. Graham Baldwin sent an email to Bill Randles (who had offered to host the debate). This proves Graham Baldwin’s interest not as a cult “expert” but as some kind of personal advocate for someone. A real cult “expert” and counsellor would not involve themselves in personal affairs like terms of a public debate, but we see Baldwin’s motive shine through clearly,

Any debate must also allow those accused by him to respond to his allegations. To date his responses to those brothers and sisters who have written to him are contemptible.
If these matters remain unanswered Catalyst will urge those damaged to assume Mr Prasch is not a Christian and to sue him, Moriel and his management team for defamation. The lawyers involved with Catalyst have advised such a law suit would be successful and are willing to act for the victims.”

Notice that Graham Baldwin employs a big “IF” here. He indicates that he will refrain from urging people to sue Jacob Prasch and Moriel Ministries if they will comply with David Nathan’s terms of debate. Is this what cult counsellors are doing these days? He is basically admitting that there is no principle reason to sue Jacob Prasch or Moriel, but that he will, in black-mail fashion, urge people to sue him if he does not comply. This sounds more like a mafia tactic than a counseling tactic. Actually, (and ironically), this sounds like the manipulative control tactics employed by cult leaders themselves in order to maintain power.
This blackmail-styled threat is not particularly surprising given that Mr. Graham Baldwin has a habit of suing people that he disagrees with; he even boasted of this in another email as something of a warning shot. In a PressGazette article written in 2001, it is documented that Graham Baldwin sued the Guardian newspaper not once, but TWICE! Mr. Baldwin sued on the basis of defamation (which is thoroughly ironic as you will see shortly). The day after the first verdict was issued, editor of The Guardian, Alan Rusbridger, according to the Press Gazzette, “said that it was a sad reflection on the libel laws that they offer so little protection to reporting matters which he believed were clearly in the public interest.” What was Graham Baldwin’s response to this comment? HE SUED THEM AGAIN! Astonishing. He claimed that their response undermined his prior victory against them. This would be the first time I have ever heard of someone suing the exact same entity twice for effectively the same thing. Baldwin appears to be quite proud of his court appearances and past lawsuits as he has boasted of them by email and video.

Mr. Baldwin is now breathing threats of litigation against Jacob Prasch and Moriel Ministries as is his M.O.
In the previously mentioned article written by Geraldine Bedelle in 1995, we gain some more insight into the character of Mr. Baldwin as she notes:

He shows me a paper on interrogation techniques, picked up on a course at the Joint Services Interrogation Wing in the 1970s, but grows mysterious when I ask what he was doing there: ‘Look, I’m not going to give you a full CV. There are some things I’m either not particularly proud of or I don’t want to talk about. Anyway, my CV does work out, because I spent some time in computing.'”

Why exactly was Mr. Baldwin being so “mysterious” about his papers on interrogation techniques? What was he doing taking a course at the Joint Services Interrogation Wing in the 1970’s? What is it he’s not so proud of? Who is Graham Baldwin, really?
Bedelle goes on to inform us that, “Baldwin claims he doesn’t work from any particular religious perspective…”
Well, isn’t that interesting? Mr. Baldwin attempts to portray himself as ambiguously Christian in his three part hit-piece on Jacob Prasch and Moriel Ministries but he plainly told this reporter that he does not work from any religious perspective. The man who gives the impression of being a Christian (when he has a Christian audience) tacitly denies Christ when asked by a secular reporter. To whom then was Mr. Baldwin telling the truth? Incidentally, his affirmation that he doesn’t work from any religious perspective coincides with the Catalyst Counselling website which states:
“Catalyst as an organisation has no religious beliefs or objectives” and “Catalyst has no religious or political position and offers help to all whatever their religion, race, sexuality or gender.”

Both Baldwin and his organization claim to have neither religious belief, perspective nor position. This man cannot and should not be considered a Christian in any sense. As you will soon see, his devious and outright brazen false witness proves him to be something quite sinister, indeed.
We will conclude this section with the concluding remarks from Bedelle’s own article:

…you can’t help thinking that an anti-cult group would be the perfect front for recruiting vulnerable people to your own set of beliefs, your own power-trip.”

After all of those concerning comments about his “mysterious” behavior, course on interrogation and defensiveness about funding, Bedelle concludes with a rather damning bit of speculation. While prefacing it by saying she doesn’t think he’s anything other that what he claims to be, this appears to be a technical way to legally justify saying what was likely on her mind. It is a rather compelling concluding mark that I can’t fathom why someone would posit if they genuinely had no reservation about an individual. Can it be that Bedelle sensed that Baldwin himself was exhibiting cult-leader tendencies and was using the position of a counselor to take advantage of people? Is it possible that that time spent in the Joint Services Interrogation Wing helped him hone in on some psychological tactics? According to Bedelle, “…you can’t help thinking…” As you will soon see from the gaslighting and manipulative “arguments” employed by Graham Baldwin, this thought grows increasingly more plausible and therefore disturbing.

 

JACOB PRASCH & MORIEL UNDER INVESTIGATION?

Mr. Baldwin’s primary claim is that Jacob Prasch is a hypocrite, which even if true, would not at all be tantamount to his assertion that what he has seen is, “spiritual bullying of the worst possible kind.”
Baldwin goes on to critique Jacob’s understanding of documentary film-making, Moriel’s finances, and his personal distaste for Jacob’s descriptions of people. All of these things have the hallmarks of a personal vendetta and not an objective desire to combat “spiritual bullying of the worse possible kind”.
It cannot be emphasized strongly enough that Baldwin himself admits that, “he doesn’t work from any particular religious perspective…” and his Catalyst Counselling organization reinforces this, saying they have no religious beliefs or objectives”. True Christianity cannot be compartmentalized (anyone who objects to this proves not to be a Christian by their utter ignorance of God’s word). Any so-called Christian who claims that they do not work from a Christian perspective is not a real Christian but a fraud who will chamellionically claim what is needed to gratify a given audience. This is important because Baldwin will employ terms such as “we, the body of Christ” in order to present himself as a Christian when he has said he works from no such perspective. Baldwin works from a secular perspective (by his own admission) with a “charity” that has been soliciting funds from people for the better part of the past decade to build a 4-centred complex that hasn’t even seen its foundation.

Graham says that he wrote to Jacob but that Jacob never bothered to reply, however, Baldwin later says that Jacob called him personally. It’s truly astounding how much this man lies from moment to moment. Which is it? Jacob never replied or he called you personally? Graham Baldwin proves to be a bald-faced liar who can’t keep track of his tangled web of deceit. This is the fruit of a man who “doesn’t work from any particular religious perspective.”

Baldwin then critiques Moriel’s finances because he has no substantive objection to any so-called “spiritual bullying of the worst possible kind”. This is a purely retaliatory move with the sole end of leveling the charge of “hypocrisy”. The personal vendetta is again evident. Even if his speculative allegations were true (which they are not), this has absolutely nothing to do with “spiritual bullying” nor “abuse” nor any of the other hyperbolic characterizations used by this gaslighing manipulator. This was a desperate search to find something to hold against Jacob Prasch and Moriel because they had no real claim to begin with. In fact, Jacob Prasch and Moriel Ministries published a financial statement in the fall of 2018 that addresses all of his defamatory speculations and undermines the better part of his videos.

The Catalyst “Cult” Conundrum

Nearly all of the articles that can be found about Catalyst Counselling or Graham Baldwin are in the context of an anti-cult group or cult experts of some kind; Baldwin himself touting his being an “expert” witness in many courts. He actually uses the words “court” or “courts” 9 times in this section, just to drive the point home. So central to their mission are cults that they even have a definition of “cult” on their website. In part it says,

For the avoidance of doubt, for us a cult is a system that produces unhealthy dependence on the group or leader to the detriment of the members, usually by using unethical methods of manipulation.”

We should note, in passing, that the term “unethical” employed by these people cannot even be interpreted by any biblical standard since they operate from no religious perspective. Therefore, whatever they mean by “unethical” will undoubtedly be at odds with what the bible means by unethical. They openly claim to operate from a secular perspective and therefore their ethics are secular. That notwithstanding, we will here focus on one aspect of this definition that is supplied by Baldwin’s own website and is therefore a definition that he subscribes to. His definition of a cult presupposes membership. This is evident and would fall in line with most accepted definitions of a cult. Where there is no clear membership their is definitionally no cult and therefore no cult activity. There even exist false teachers in the world who are not cult leaders as the definition of a cult is very specific including (but not limited to) membership where a tyrannical leader has control over the members. In his second and more vitriolic video about Jacob Prasch and Moriel Ministries, Baldwin says,

I can’t ever remember, in the 30 odd years I’ve worked in the cult field, any cult leader, secular or in any other religious group that has ever used the language that Jacob has used; that has ever told the lies that he has told, but more than that, that has his members believing that he’s infallible.”

Baldwin again displays either supreme ignorance or supreme deceit. What then has this so-called cult “expert” to do with Moriel Ministries? Moriel Ministries has NO membership (though Baldwin falsely asserts otherwise) and therefore has no authority over anyone who decides to engage with or humor the teachings provided by Moriel. Does Graham Baldwin know the definition of “membership” or is he just knowingly making false allegations? Moriel Ministries has “membership” in the same way that a Television channel has “membership”. While there are stewards operating it,

Graham Baldwin

people can choose to turn it on or not. Jacob Prasch is an itinerant teacher who speaks where he is invited. None of the people that are portrayed as “victims” of Jacob Prasch are members of anything to do with Jacob Prasch as there is nothing to be a “member” of. Yet, Mr. Baldwin implicitly condemns Jacob Prasch as something of a cult leader by mentioning him in comparison to other cult leaders. Why else would a cult “expert” be making films about him? Perhaps more confounding is the fervor with which Baldwin has attacked and slandered Jacob Prasch and Moriel Ministries. He claims to be a cult “expert” who has given testimony in several court cases and counselled people who were taken in with cults and so forth. The Catalyst organization was founded in 1995, so for nearly 25 years this man has been purportedly contending with cults. Why then did a YouTube channel from this organization only emerge in December of 2018? Even if they were late to the digital media arena, why are the only videos they have produced focused on an organization that has no membership and a decidedly evangelical statement of faith well within the confines of Christian orthodoxy? Given these two things alone, it is impossible to construe Moriel Ministries as a cult or anything even close to it. In fact, Jacob Prasch himself has been on the front lines combating the cults in the public arena since long before the inception of Catalyst Counselling. Are we to believe that a cult counselling organization is so “shocked” and “horrified” as to make their breakout videos warning about a ministry that has done more to publicly combat cults that they ever have (in terms of sheer volume of digital media)? This is an outlandish proposition that Lewis Carroll would find difficult to indulge even in the realm of Wonderland. This so-called anti-cult counselling organization has not produced a single video on the Exclusive Brethren, Jesus Army, FLDS, Scientology, the Watchtower Society or any number of recognized, established and influential cults in the world? This does not pass the smell test. Mr. Baldwin says that the claims made by Jacob Prasch are “spiritual bullying of the worst possible kind.” and that he “…can’t ever remember… any cult leader…that has ever told the lies that he has told…that has his members believing that he’s infallible.”

 

Can someone please furnish Mr. Badlwin with an internet connection and a computer? Has he never heard of the droves of molestation accusations and cases surrounding the exclusive brethren, the mass suicide at Jonestown, the castrations performed by Marshall Applewhite on his Heaven’s Gate members, the murders directed by Manson, etc? This is one of the most laughably outlandish and outright stupid propositions I have ever heard. Not only does this claim alone undermine any “credentials” Mr. Baldwin may or may not have by proving he is either extremely ignorant, delusional or a liar, but it also undermines the credibility of those who give him credence. Any person who would give this lying man credibility proves that they are deceitful and wicked themselves.

These are the only 3 options I can see; ignorance, delusion or deceit. He trivializes real acts of spiritual bullying that have led even to death by surmising that Jacob’s critiques of people he has absolutely no authority over in any way as being “the worst possible kind.” Has Mr. Baldwin ever read of literal physical cult abuse that has led even to death? Is he ignorant of these things? If so, then he is no “expert”. Does he believe that a video critique of another is equal in severity to death? This would be delusional. Or has Mr. Baldwin accused Jacob Prasch of something that that he knows to be false and not at all on par with “the worst possible kind.” Pardon my speculation here, but wouldn’t spiritual bullying that culminated in physical harm or death be the worst possible kind? If so, then the only three options that explain what Mr. Baldwin has claimed are: ignorance, delusion, or deceit. Which of these three are landed upon it matters not. Any of them are enough to thoroughly discredit anyone as an “expert” or a moral arbiter of any kind. We already know that Baldwin has been deceitful about his beliefs; one moment claiming that he does not work from any religious perspective and the next claiming that he is part of the body of Christ and imploring a predominantly Christian audience to the bible. Graham the guileful strikes again. You can see then that it makes no sense in the realm of reasonable reality that an anti-cult group would make videos attacking a ministry which cannot even accidentally be deemed as as a cult or anything close to it even by their own definition. Much less does this bode well for the reasonable when we consider the myriad cults in existence who have bullied people to the point of death that Graham Baldwin has failed to make videos about. According to The Sun, there are at least 1000 cults in the UK. These are real cults involved in activities like keeping slaves, forced sex acts, hypnosis, food and sleep deprivation, etc! Of all these legitimate cults, Mr. Baldwin has not addressed any of them by video; NOT EVEN ONE! He ignores 1000 real cults and targets an evangelical ministry that literally has orphanages in the third world and has fought against cults longer than the Catalyst organization has even existed, while saying he has “no axe to grind”? This is pure manipulation fueled by retaliation.
909 people committed mass suicide in Jonestown in 1978, but Graham Baldwin the “expert” says that Jacob Prasch the evangelical minister who presides over no member in any organization has exhibited “spiritual bullying of the worst possible kind.” This sounds like satire it is so nonsensical. Unfortunately, when someone pawns, as legitimate, an idea that is so outlandish that satire is the only other viable comparison, that person is either deluded or a cunning manipulator. Whoever gave Catalyst Counselling charity status should be investigated at once for dereliction. This man, by his mendacious tactics and/or waxing delusion proves to have something in common with cult leaders. These are exactly the type of psychological gaslighing tactics used by a manipulator to make others believe things that aren’t real. I can only suggest that listening to Graham Baldwin is a dangerous exercise that will lead you into unrealities very much like listening to a cult leader would. Don’t forget that Graham Baldwin has papers from a course he took on interrogation techniques that even a reporter seemed concerned about.

Baldwin laments is his second video, which is a 44 minute bumbling mess, that someone wrote to him saying that Jacob was praying that God would curse him. Graham is bewildered by this saying, “we are told in the New Testament to love our enemies; to pray for our enemies.” Wait a minute, Graham. I thought you didn’t work from any religious perspective? Given that the Catalyst logo was displayed on your Catalyst channel, I guess that makes you and your organization a heap of liars, since this was a Catalyst project you were working on. I wonder if that will put your “charity” status in jeopardy. Did you apprise The Charity Commission For England And Wales that your organization is now claiming to be conclusively Christian and that you are imploring people from a Christian perspective? We’ll make sure to tell them of your mixed signals since your website says the exact opposite. He gives no evidence of this claim against Jacob Prasch wanting him cursed; no email, no name, but just says someone told him this. Even if true, I guess he has never heard of an imprecatory prayer? Didn’t he say he received a BA in Divinity? I guess in all his studies he just skipped the book of Psalms entirely? Well done, Mr. Baldwin. You prove again that we should believe your original statement that you truly work from no religious perspective and certainly not a Christian one as your ignorance shows. Allow me to aid you with the words of the Apostle Paul in 2 Timothy 4:14 “May the Lord repay him according to his works.” If Jacob did say this, I echo his prayer and ask that God would judge you for the deceitful liar you are and repay you accordingly.
Hypocritically, of course, the same Graham in his first video said that he was going to urge people that Jacob was not a Christian and should be treated like a pagan and sued. What a deranged hypocrite who can’t even abide by his own standard. This man stacks the deck as he goes. If Jacob Prasch is your enemy, Mr. Baldwin, why are you not simply loving him and praying for him instead of urging people to sue him? What a tangled web of hypocritical contradiction.
He goes on to say that he is getting really “fed up” with the way that Jacob talks. Well, Mr. Baldwin, anyone who is in the business of truth is no doubt quite “fed up” with your gaslighing lies and manipulation. The entire second video put out by this dreamer is speculation about Moriel’s finances and baseless accusations about drinking habits that can only be described as pure hate-filled slander. Astonishingly, Graham Baldwin says he is particularly annoyed with the lack of evidence that Jacob Prasch presents. Had I been drinking anything when I heard this my computer would be ruined. The theme of Baldwin’s videos could be summed up in two words; SPECULATIVE HATE.

At about the 27:45 mark of his second video (in which can be seen the subtext “Prasch spreads false testimony”) Baldwin laments that Jacob Prasch reported that two women had shared information about a conference they were at in which they were said to have heard some questionable teachings.

Baldwin’s Hypocrisy

Baldwin’s assertion in print is that this is a false testimony and he indicates that this was imprudent and an unfair way to make assessments. This is Baldwin’s own standard, mind you. In his very next breath he states that he is going to do the exact same thing to Jacob (as some type of payback I suppose) and he goes on to say someone told him Jacob had a drinking problem. By his own admission this was purely an act of spite and revenge, proving Mr. Baldwin to be an unprincipled and devious man. If Mr. Baldwin truly believes this to be an unfair and unwise method then is he not repaying evil for evil? He shows what he claims is an e-mail extract from a former Moriel administrator that he fails to name or provide any evidence of which says that they witnessed Jacob purchase some alcoholic drink. Even if this claim were true. SO WHAT? The bible does not forbid drinking, but I wouldn’t expect the gleefully ignorant Mr. Baldwin to know that at this point. Has Jacob Prasch taken the vow of a Nazarite? Is he implying that having an occasional drink is forbidden? What hogwash. This supposed email extract did not say nor even hint that Jacob was ever drunk much less drunk at that time. It simply says that they believed he had a drink. Allow me to remind you that the water Jesus turned into wine was fermented. Good luck with that one you accusing babblers. There is no passage that says all alcohol must be abstained from and as such, this point is frankly a stupid one even if true. Two individuals who have been at the forefront of this wave against Moriel have even admitted that they don’t believe for a second that Jacob has a drinking problem. So even Jabob’s enemies deny this false claim. That alone should tell you how desperate Baldwin is to make a point that isn’t there. He then says some woman felt uncomfortable around Jacob in the vaguest terms possible. Graham is working overtime to fight battles no cult “expert” would waste their time on. The contrived nature of these productions is so apparent and manipulative as to be disturbingly in accord with Satan’s devices as an accuser of the brethren.

 

Down To Brass Tacks

While Graham Baldwin is the more public face of this coalition, it is indeed a coalition. They have gone on to claim people like John Haller and Bill Randles are somehow deluded and blindly following Jacob Prasch when nothing can be further from the truth. This was always about David Nathan and his heretical teachings. At one point in his first video, Graham Baldwin makes the claim that the people which were “attacked” had initially had a good relationship with Jacob Prasch and Moriel. This seems to be a means of establishing Jacob and Moriel’s accusers as reasonable and objective because they at one time agreed with and supported Jacob and Moriel. Apparently Mr. Baldwin suffers from short term memory loss as literally 40 seconds prior to this statement, he said, “…this was not something we were going to take too seriously, and the reason for this is that so often in organizations; churches and any group, there are sometimes personality clashes, and it is very difficult to actually work out what has actually gone on by the testimony from two sides.” So, Baldwin himself admits that “personality clashes” in any organization are quite normal; so normal in fact he claims he was poised to dismiss these alleged “complaints” but then makes the point that these people that were “attacked” at one point supported Moriel. Of course they did, Mr. Baldwin. Why is that surprising? You yourself acknowledge personality clashes happen within organizations. It goes without saying, then, that those people complaining at one time supported the organization. This is the entire basis of his “counselling service”. He supposedly helps people who were entrapped by cults. Is it necessary to state that the person who is now complaining about the organization at one time supported it? This is a manipulative tactic intended to portray his “clients” (so to speak) as innocent and objective victims who had no reason to come against Jacob Prasch or Moriel. Apparently Mr. Baldwin is so bereft of logical deduction as to be abysmally unaware of the fact that this is a two way street. Namely, that Jacob Prasch and Moriel were also once on good terms with the same individuals. In short, the emotional plea he is making in favor of those who were “attacked” could rightly be made in defense of Jacob Prasch and Moriel Ministries as well.

Graham Baldwin appears to be a pawn in this game, but no less guilty. He has become a willing participant in a smear campaign and was happy to be the face of it. He is therefore a partaker in this wickedness, and insofar as he wants to be a public representative he has been publicly cross-examined as it were. Drug dealers don’t exist without drug users; both are necessary for the illicit dance to commence.
Things like this are not usually worth my time, nor does Moriel seem particularly interested in responding to things that are so evidently absurd, but since Graham shows no signs of slowing, nor do I believe they will ever stop their campaign, I deemed it prudent to have something floating around for others to view should their curiosity ever be stoked or should they unfortunately give heed to these lies for a time. This is otherwise an ordeal that is irrelevant and birthed from the womb of vengeance which seeks to distract from the true work of the kingdom of God. Exposing truly damaging doctrines and practices that lead others astray is a worthwhile cause, but this sort of unceasing personal vengeance and campaign of defamation is what the children of Herodias will ceaselessly endeavor in.

 

UPDATE

Unsurprisingly, Graham Baldwin breathed threats of litigation against me in his last and even more ridiculous video. As was shown in this article, threatening to sue people seems to be a habitual practice for this man and this alone is evidence that he is not a Christian. The Bible calls Christians to suffer wrong even from the world. In Matthew 5:40, Jesus said, “If anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, let him have your coat also.
Not only are Christians bid NOT to sue others they are even commanded not to retaliate in the face of others doing this wrong. That Graham Baldwin makes it a habit of threatening to sue people is all the evidence you need to know that he cannot possibly be a Christian. ANYONE who lends credibility to the idea that he is a Christian in light of this evidence calls into question their own “christianity” such that, without immediate repentance and repudiation of this affirmation, they prove themselves not to be Christians either.

 

 

 

Share this...

Joshua Chavez

A slave of Christ. My name is Joshua Chavez.

You may also like...

39 Responses

  1. Frank Rogers says:

    No Mr. Christi I will not be making any vindictive videos against you. I pray for you and I wish you the best bro. I am sorry if my video of you hiding the emails was not accurate but it appeared your name was frequently mentioned while discussing issues on facebook and posting, so it appeared you were the one posting. And it also appeared MANY MANY falsities were being posted as I do indeed have the proof of inaccuracy or dishonesty. But this war is getting ridiculous and indeed I do feel anger in my heart. But my anger is quickly turning to sadness for you sir. God bless you, may God begin healing the anger we all have inside in this media war and turn it into peace and forgiveness. (thank you for your spelling corrections, I would like to return it, millennium is spelled with two N’s).

    • Joshua Chavez says:

      Frank,
      You have ALREADY made vindictive videos mentioning me specifically. Yes, your information was inaccurate and as such it ought to be removed. My having knowledge of any email is not the same as me “hiding” anything. I do not operate Moriel’s facebook page. Now, you have to contend with the unfortunate realities concerning Graham Baldwin and Deborah Menelaws whom you have defended. Graham Baldwin is a deceiver and you are propagating his falsehoods.

      Joshua

  2. Frank Rogers says:

    Dear Mr. Chavez, I looked back at the Moriel facebook postings and found you telling others your name is Joshua as the Moriel TV avatar. I will not venture to say this is a lie but I would ask you to clarify please. Your email address is also in the circulation of the proposed debate why did you not correct the untruth and ask Jacob to correct it? You also criticize Deborah for “spying” but it certainly looks like you do plenty of the same. You must ask yourself brother if all this “disgruntled” “jezebels” and “demonically deceived” people are really filled with spirits or if there is fair grounds to be hurt and upset? What about Bill Randles defending the evil Menelaws does that make him a heretic as well? What about IFB and Sally? What about Moriel Cananada who dropped out? They must all just be manipulated puppets of satan right? You keep on believing it brother. Blessings to you once again on you and all those at Moriel.

    • Joshua Chavez says:

      Frank,
      That was for a very brief time prior to any of the David Nathan debate talk. I have had nothing to do with Moriel’s Facebook page for quite a long time. You cite the people that “dropped” out or who have defended David Nathan, but you ignore the many more who have stood by Jacob’s assessment that David Nathan is indeed a heretic. What about their assessments? According to you, all those who have agreed with Jacob must be “manipulated puppets of satan” right? It works both ways. Bill Randles said did not like Jacob’s approach but did not defend the position of Deborah and has openly voiced his strong concern for David Nathan. Others have been more vocal. The evidence of Deborah’s manipulative and hypocritical tactics here are undeniable and Graham Baldwin’s mercenary-style dealings are made obvious. David Nathan teaches heresy and they defend it. It is really quite simple. This whole ordeal is really not worth much more of my time, but as Graham Baldwin seems to think he’s leading a charge in some “investigation” and potentially confusing others, this will now be around for them to observe. You keep on believing it, Frank.

      Joshua

      • Frank Rogers says:

        Joshua I am willing to delete the videos concerning you however do you see the twisting that Jacob has done? Why did he hide half of David Nathan’s email concerning him vindicating David is false doctrine? Why did he spread an email about David brig a Judas and pusher is manure and at the same time say He respects Davis what kind of man lies like that? David asked many times to have a meeting to clarify and it was obvious that Jacob wouldn’t give him the time or day. And don’t pretend it was the menelaws creating the war, Jacob made 7 videos attacking the menelaws calling them the most vile of names. Stewart never ONCE called Jacob anything. At least be fair here brother. There is record of Jacob calling people sick names for over 20 years this isn’t some recent event. I appreciate your response. (Many of us did not agree with the original words of David on these few issues but he should be allowed to correct and discuss his position respectfully not tossed out like a rotten piece of fruit.)

        • Joshua Chavez says:

          Frank,
          Please take note that Deborah and Stewart Menelaws themselves had no issue with any of Jacob’s actions for the past 20 years. They have never accused him of “sick” name calling in that time. This has been a retroactive hunt for wrongdoing which they never opposed. Allow me to suggest that you extend the same grace that was extended by Deborah Menelaws herself for the past 20 years. She has only objected to Jacob in light of his stance against David Nathan and subsequently herself. But, if she had no issue with him for the past 20 years, then you should use her previous standard and leave the past 20 years out of it as well. Also, Jacob responded to them in 3 videos, not 7. They didn’t bother to call Jacob before making their defense of David Nathan which was disingenuously done. This is a very one-sided argument, Frank. David Nathan was and is teaching demonstrable heresy and there is no denying that. The fact that the Menelaws themselves removed his teaching catalog from their YouTube channel ought to tell you something.

          Joshua

  3. Frank Rogers says:

    Dear Sir, if you are willing to email dialogue with me concerning the David Nathan fiasco and what appears to be many dishonesties by Jacob, I will drop my YouTube account and simply pray for the situation. I only want you to see why many of us believe Jacob was operating wrongly in the situation towards both David and the menelaws.

    • Joshua Chavez says:

      Frank,
      If you are even considering taking that action, it should be done for conscience sake and the sake of propriety. Those videos are riddled with falsehoods and pure slander. Giving an ultimatum like this will only make it look spiteful if you fail to take this proposed action. For your own sake, I pray you do the right thing. As it stands, you are propagating falsehood and petty slander; ironically the things Jacob is being accused of. If you wish to send an email, there is a contact page on this website. But, again, that you say you are even willing to do it merely if I hear your perspective means there is not a principle reason to leave those up except as some form of retaliation. You should really think about this, Frank.

      Joshua

  4. phil says:

    Josh – love your work – these people have no shame

    • Joshua Chavez says:

      Phil,
      Sadly, this is such a shameful campaign that those marching in it must have a conscience seared with a hot iron.
      The Lord will deal with them.

      Joshua

  5. Kelly Quinn says:

    To Moriel, Josh, and Friends of the ministry,
    I take this public stand to say i stand with Moriel, Jacob, Josh on this issue.
    I was once deluded to watch David Nathan on YouTube after seeing it on Moriel. And engaged with face book with Tim, David. etc. Awhile ago I have had my own problems, And asked advise from David Nathan about things, more or less to get a different perspective on a personal matter. and not about Moriel the same goes with TIm. When things began to explode i took the defensive, but quickly learned otherwise. Also not realizing i too was infiltrated by the same people on my friends list. I hope that they have been blocked. Their defamatory rhetoric made me sick and confused.
    But no more, As Jacob said “leave me out of it”. God Bless

  6. Frank Rogers says:

    Josh, that’s quite illogical. No I do not believe everyone who stood with Moriel are “ahab jezebels” the whole point was to point to the hypocrisy of the judgement! If Bill Randles states that the Menelaws continue to be his friends and should not be vilified as such then that makes Jacob guilty of the sins of Heresy as Bill Randles associates with heretics who deafens a heretic. Time to cut Bill Randles off right? You guys label everyone heretics and servants of Satan, yet you never own up to your own hypocrisy. You say in your teaching on tithing that we should be able to pronounce judgement on people because Paul called people fools, Jesus called them vipers. Jacob states he can call people STUPID because Jeremiah did under the spirit of the Lord. Seriously bro, that judgement is for those under direct inspiration from God. We are far too infallible.

    The issue never was about David Nathan’s Heresy. It was about Jacob’s deceitful handling of the situation. Look at all the emails, the only one was Jacob telling someone that David was in the clear, that he was simply misunderstood! Then a week before cutting David off he asks David to go speak at a conference with him! Jacob never corrected him in the Bill Randles David Nathan conference in the so called “edited” clip you speak of. There was no editing! he simply took the portion where David said he believes that only Jesus blood saves. Anyone can go watch the rest! in the rest of the video Jacob never corrects him only says that He like David, is not dogmatic about his view on the wedding feast. What a load of dishonesty. I looked at each new “heresy” that Jacob brought out and it was more lying to character assassinate this man. He only wanted to be able to speak for himself to work things out but Jacob would not. He took it public and never let up. Did David ever call him any name? Only once, he called him a liar when Jacob was hiding the email portion on the video stating that he had cleared David Nathan of heresy. Wake up brother!! stop being a dishonest judge! The Menelaws never said they defend David’s portions they only wanted to give him a chance to speak for himself to explain himself. Suddenly they are ahab and jezebels? Jacob lied worst about their Sordid gain that is an EVIL EVIL judgement on people who make nothing off their ministry! These are vindictive lies, but I don’t call Jacob a servant of the Devil. He is simply and intelligent prideful man who hates to be disagreed with. If you point flaw in his messages, or wrong judgement its “off with his head”. Cant you see the simple spirit of pride, anger, rage, dishonesty? is it so far from you to see what’s right in front of you? All these people angry at Jacob had no beef with him! Not David, Not Louis Erasmus, NOT ME, not the Menelaws, not Tim Wirth, not tbcqawaii, not Graham Baldwin. We just all recognize an arrogant bully who needs to behave like a christian that’s all! I do not know the Menelaws I only know what I see as pure hypocritical dishonesty and sinful anger. So you may continue to hide behind “spiritual judging” or you can wakeup, softly correct Jacob as his friend, help get your friend’s ministry back on track and make the Lord happy in your humility. Or you can continue to make the blind judgement you are doing now. We only have one life to live Joshua, lets not look back in sadness at the poor paths we choose. Life goes by fast.

    • Joshua Chavez says:

      Frank,
      Your videos are fraudulent and riddled with lies and blatant petty slander. David Nathan’s response was disingenuous and itself a lie. Along with Stewart Menelaws, David Nathan claimed that he never taught as prescriptive that believers could anoint clothing with power. This is an out and out lie and we have published him teaching it prescriptively. To deny this is to deny reality. David Nathan is a liar. He also re-framed the question about the blood of Jesus being eternal. He said he believes it is eternal, but was referring to those who are already saved. This is a clever means of still holding on to his doctrine that the blood of animals will atone for sin in the future. This is rank heresy. As for your statement that, “The Menelaws never said they defend David’s portions they only wanted to give him a chance to speak for himself to explain himself.” You are either speaking from ignorance or you are lying. Stewart didn’t merely provide a platform for David but called the allegations “cancerous” and claimed vehemently that he has never heard anything even approaching heresy from David Nathan, and that was in light of already broadcast teachings of the heresy. Stewart is a liar as well. Jacob personally reached out to Stewart and asked him to stop all of this and call a truce so that each could go their own way. Stewart knows this and they persist in their nonsense. Graham Baldwin is a manipulative con-artist who is not even a Christian. Neither did Jacob have an issue with any of these people prior. Your argument can be used as a defense of Jacob. It’s baffling how willing you are to ignore the reality that Stewart Menelaws openly and decidedly defended David Nathan and his positions; declaring him innocent. You just bore false witness denying this. Jacob was about to speak, clearly seen in the video, before Bill Randles interjected. It was ambiguously stated. You are wasting your time defending the indefensible, Frank. You are still attempting to level defenses of the Menelaws when they went out of their way to remove the portion that prompted Bill Randles to speak as he was concerned, which Bill later confirmed. Menelaws own group has subsequently attacked Bill Randles. Wake up and stop being a dishonest judge. You have publicly made slanderous and ridiculous false allegations and promoted a deceiving unbeliever named Baldwin who has said demonstrably worse things about Jacob than he said about anyone you are attempting to defend. You are quite the hypocrite. You falsely accused me of things I never did, and then went on to critique Jacob’s pronunciation of things. You should be ashamed of yourself. You offered some ultimatum to remove your videos showing that you have no principle reason to keep them there. This is spiteful and retaliatory. Those videos are petty and have little to nothing to do with your objections here. So you may continue to hide behind “spiritual judging” or you can wakeup, softly correct the Menelaws as a friend, help get your friend’s ministry back on track and make the Lord happy in your humility. Or you can continue to make the blind judgement you are doing now. We only have one life to live Frank, lets not look back in sadness at the poor paths we choose. Life goes by fast.

  7. colin higgs says:

    Joshua Chavez I thank you for your article and have been looking at the comments made. I have also on many occasions placed comments on the videos placed by ( Frank Rogers, Deborah Menelaws, Tbckawaii, Graham Baldwin et al) some of which have been completely misconstrued, But I fairness to Frank one of my misspelt words in a comment was recognised by Frank after communication. Which is more than can be said for Mr Baldwin and the mocking Scottish psychologist Tbckawaii whose videos, quite frankly, are a disgrace but who has built up a reputation with this fan club and has added more fuel to the fire for Deborah Menelaws to fan and inflame the process.
    When the “Right to reply” video was made by G247 TV, I pointed out at the time that it was biased and gave my reasons. That Stewart himself bought into the video his own personal dispute with Jacob over emails that had been sent to the Menelaws, stating that he would be dealing with those later. If this doesn’t plant a seed to be biased in an interview I don’t know what is. Also I believed and said so at the time that most of the questions and the way they were put to David were indeed leading questions. I have been following most of the debates and videos and as such giving my points of view regularly. Because of this, I have been called a liar, a member o a cult and that I am an idolater in as much as I idolize Jacob. All of these accusations are based on the fact that I disagree with much that has been put upon Jacob. I do not defend his manner of speech at times, and have said so in many comments. But like many that have known him for years , as I have the Menelaws, and I am sure many on here will agree, he has not really changed over the years in the way he describes and puts things, but it never seemed to be a great block then , so why now. I put it to you is because the statements and teachings of certain things by David Nathann became the dividing point between us. The rest has become personality attacks and mockery and has no place in God’s children’s ways. Sadly, Frank the majority of the mocking has come through the Menelaws’ camp, and this has proved to be a great draw for those who have promoted such.
    I have no axe to grind with anyone but will state that, warts and all, I will continue to watch and listen to teachers and preachers who I believe I can trust, and will check carefully and question that which I do not at the time agree with, or fully understand. I will also, if I believe that those teachers etc., have in my opinion got something wrong I will contact them directly and not through the social media, to discuss and come to a conclusion. May God bring this miserable battle to an end.

    • Joshua Chavez says:

      Colin,
      This whole thing has been a needless unfortunate mess that was result of heretical doctrine being taught by David Nathan. Jacob Prasch reached out to Deborah personally several months ago and told her he did not want a war with them and amicably asked them to stop speaking about Moriel. They have incessantly commented ever since. Jacob privately tried to dissuade them from continuing this saga, but it was THEY who kept it up. I agree, I pray God would bring this miserable battle to an end, but mark my words, that coalition will continue. The last Catalyst video even said they have more to come. This is nothing more than a personal vendetta. As I told Frank Rogers, Deborah had no problem with any of Jacob’s “behavior” for the past 20 years, but now wants to condemn him retroactively though she had no problem with him in the past. It’s pure retaliation. Sad. Deborah has mocked countless women who have objected to what she is doing (many more than were referenced in this article), nevertheless, let God sort it out at this point. As for me, I have nothing more to say. This has become a distraction from real work. These people are agitators and instigators. But this crafty deceiver Mr. Baldwin needed to be held accountable.
      God bless.
      Joshua

  8. April Elliott says:

    Thank you Joshua, what an incredible article you have written, you have nailed it! What a tremendous amount of work you have provided us. I pray for Jacob all the time and will add you. Thank you for being there for Jacob, he needs brothers like you.

    • Joshua Chavez says:

      April,
      Blessings to you. May the Lord vindicate His servants for His name’s sake. Satan never sleeps and is working overtime to undermine true work of the kingdom. By God’s grace, in Jesus’ strength we can overcome his ploys as “we have the mind of Christ.” (1 Cor. 2:16). Satan’s schemes only appear to prevail temporarily, but God allows them for many reasons. Our God will provide the victory. He may use us, but only as tools in His hand.
      “The LORD, who delivered me from the paw of the lion and from the paw of the bear, He will deliver me from the hand of this Philistine.” (1 Sam. 17:37)

      God bless,
      Joshua

  9. Dee says:

    Hi Josh what do you teach about salvation? Could you please elaborate a little more? This is your statement of faith:

    We believe in salvation through the New Birth experience by repentance and faith in Jesus ALONE as the only provision for man’s sin.

    1. What do you mean by Repentance and faith? What is your definition of Repentance pertaining to salvation?

    This is your statement under “The Gospel” on your page:
    8). He bore the sin of the world and the very wrath of God (1 John 2:2/ Matthew 27:46), that whosoever would come to Him (John 3:16), forsaking their sin, could do so through His shed blood.

    2.What do you mean when you your stating that somebody needs to “forsake their sin” in this statement?
    Thanks

    • Joshua Chavez says:

      Dee,
      By “repentance and faith” I mean what Jesus said in Mark 1:15
      “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel.”
      The word “believe” here is “pisteuō” in Greek which comes from the word “pistis” which is typically translated as “faith”
      Believers are saved by grace ALONE, through faith ALONE in Christ ALONE.
      Repentance is not a “work” as some claim but is part and parcel of true faith. As shadows are evidence of a solid object, so repentance is the evidence of real faith. Neither exist without the other. Shadows do not exist independently from solid objects, and all solid objects will indeed produce a shadow.

      The term “repent” (metanoeō) means to change one’s mind; to think differently or afterwards, i.e. reconsider (morally, feel compunction)
      One who has faith in God is changing their mind from former ways which means that their repentance and faith are two ends of the same coin as “faith” is a conviction or persuasion or belief and can also indicate the character of one who can be relied on (faithfulness).
      The thief on the cross had faith in Jesus to the extent that Jesus said to him, “…today you will be with Me in Paradise” (Luke 22:43)
      His words to Jesus; “Lord, remember me when You come into Your kingdom” are themselves repentant words in that he was changing his mind from not believing to believing (faith). His faith in Jesus was repentance.
      Jesus, by His words in Mark 1:15 indicates that there is no such thing as faith without repentance. Belief or faith presupposes repentance (change of mind). In order to believe, you must change your mind about how you formerly thought (repent).
      The term “forsaking their sin” is synonymous with repentance as described above. One who has not forsaken their sin has not been party to true saving faith. One may, indeed, struggle with or contend with sin, but if they have not “changed their mind” (repentance) about sin, they have not understood faith in Christ to begin with.
      “How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it?” (Romans 6:2)
      Paul assumes that those who have professed faith in Christ have “died to sin” (forsaking their sin).
      Therefore, faith and repentance are inseparable. James 2 gives us more insight:
      “But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?” (James 2:20)

      Let me be clear, only faith can save a man; faith in the Lord Jesus Christ:
      “For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.” (Ephesians 2:8-9)

      Let me be clear again with 3 quotes from Peter, John the Baptist and Jesus respectively:
      Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, so that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord,” (Acts 3:19 – Peter)
      Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand!” (Matthew 3:2 – John the Baptist)
      Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” (Matthew 4:17 – Jesus)
      and again
      “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel.” (Mark 1:15 – Jesus)
      We see then that repentance is indispensable from true faith. Where there is no repentance, so-called faith is illusory. Any “Gospel” which does not include repentance is not in accord with the Gospel preached by the apostles and Jesus Himself. Jesus said he came to call sinners to REPENTANCE (Matthew 9:13).

      As Martyn Lloyd-Jones said, “Repentance always comes first….the need is forgiveness, but the door to it is repentance.”

      And as Mr. Spurgeon said, “Oh, how blessed it is to know where these two lines meet, the stripping of repentance, and the clothing of faith! The repentance that ejects sin as an evil tenant, and the faith which admits Christ to be the sole master of the heart; the repentance which purges the soul from dead works, and the faith that fills the soul with living works; the repentance which pulls down, and the faith which builds up; the repentance that scatters stones, and the faith which puts stones together; the repentance which ordains a time to weep, and the faith that gives a time to dance— these two things together make up the work of grace within, whereby men’s souls are saved. Be it, then, laid down as a great truth, most plainly written in our text, that the repentance we ought to preach is one connected with faith, and thus we may preach repentance and faith together without any difficulty whatever.”

      I pray that helps to clarify
      Joshua

  10. Elizabeth Vaughan says:

    Wow…thanks for filling in all of the missing pieces to this puzzle of deceit . I had joined the old “friends of Moriel” Facebook page years ago to keep up with recent postings of Jacob’s teaching and news from the organization . One day a couple of years ago there was a particularly outrageous post from a woman who was using her maiden name to post .Later, I later learned upon some investigation that it was Deb Menelaws . I called her out on her unscriptural post . She raged against me and the original target in a string of posts . Now I don’t even remember the topic . An admin messaged me questioning if I knew who it was And what was her beef . I told him who I had found out and although I knew no one personally that it was worth looking into because she was trouble with a capital T . Later she apologized claiming not feeling well and a lack of sleep for her unchristian raging and deleted the entire thread . She had shown her true color .
    As for Tim Worth .Yeah I have a soft spot for families who have members who have Alzheimer’s . And did donate but never saw anything that made me think it was for or toward the ministry . I believe you regarding the passwords because we had an employee who was dismissed, try the same stunt at our business .
    As for the David Nathan .I had never listened to his teaching because I came out of “word of Faith” and recognize it pretty quick ,so no loss .
    Thanks for completing the picture .

    • Joshua Chavez says:

      Elizabeth,
      It has been a most unfortunate tale that all revolves around David Nathan’s heretical teachings and the willingness of others to defend such heresies. They wanted to make it personal because the doctrines were indefensible. Grateful to the Lord that this has afforded you some clarity in the matter. God bless.
      Joshua

  11. Mary says:

    I have listened to hours of teaching by Jacob Prasch, David Nathan, Stuart & Deborah Menelaws.
    I have met and spoken to both David Nathan & Jacob Prasch, the difference between these two brothers are vast , David walks in the Spirit as this is seen by the good fruit he produces! But sadly, I have never seen any Spiritual fruit in Jacobs life, although I have looked very hard for it!

    • Joshua Chavez says:

      Mary,
      The “fruit” David Nathan is bearing is the teaching of heresy. Whatever “spirit”, therefore, that is guiding him cannot be holy. David Nathan is a liar and so are those who continue to defend him.

  12. Wayne says:

    Thank you for you work in keeping the truth apart from error.
    Many subtle attacks are becoming more frequent as God continues to separate truth from error. Keeping our hearts pure and exposing heresies is a must in thses dark days.
    May God continue to bless all those at moriel and keep us from falling into Apostasy.
    Once again, thank you.

    • Joshua Chavez says:

      Wayne,
      God bless. I pray the Lord used this to help clarify an otherwise ridiculous barrage of false allegations. The people behind this campaign are astonishingly manipulative and heaping up judgment for themselves. The Lord prepares a table before us in the presence of our enemies (Psalm 23). Let them have their fill of hypocrisy and false-hood.

      Joshua

  13. Charlene says:

    I’m not sure where you stand about Jacob Prasch, but I do know in simple words, that God led me to his Biblical teaching, and i do know it is Scripturally sound. People of God who speak the REAL TRUTH of God, WILL BE spoke against. you, I’m sure know that for yourself, since you reveal a lot of apostasy and herectical teaching. God led me away from ministries who were unscriptural and in deception, leading people away from the real truth. I hope you aren’t trashing Jacob Prasch at all. I always ask God to keep me in His truth and show me any deception or anything that goes against His Word. Jacob Prasch is a true man of God, and only teaches the Truth. some may not be in agreement with everything, such as the rapture, post trib, pre trib, etc. But his teaching is sound.

  14. Christina Holzschuh says:

    Jacob Prasch has rightly and scripturally exposed teachers/preachers regarding “False Doctrine”. We have the Word of God, and if you listen to David Nathan, and others, you can certainly see for yourself that Jacob adheres to Scripture. He is like Donald Trump…He gets to the point, He’s not afraid to tell the Truth, and can bring up scripture to shine the light on “Doctrinal Errors”, like Amir Tsfarti has done regarding equating Michael the Archangel as being Jesus. I urge all who are against Jacob, to open your Bible, and watch the false teachers…Do your own diligence. You will find that Jacob is rightly diving the Word. I knew 40 years ago, as a young believer, that the catholic church taught incorrectly. It’s a sun worshipping cult. Jacob is one of the few left who will still have the courage to speak out against false doctrine. His “Fruit of the Spirit” IS the Truth that he Preaches.

  15. Chromedaffodils says:

    Joshua, could you help me study out what you said ‘Christians shouldn’t sue anyone’ because I don’t want to sin. I don’t know where to study this out. Do you think you could do a video study of the matter? I know Christians should not attack each other that way, but say I get cancer from roundup, would joining a class action to recover my financial loss and also the monetary judgement is a deterant for companies killing us with chemicals so they can sell more contaminated food, it’s almost a war and an act of saving others etc. YET if my FATHER doesn’t approve, I need to search this matter out. Please advise, thank you, much love to the brethren!

  16. C. Conley says:

    Just seeing this. Thank You Joshua for persevering in this battle in presenting the truth. I pray the LORD’s bountiful blessings in your labors and those of Jacob and MORIEL!

  17. Carey says:

    I only learned about this video today. From sandy Simpson’s YouTube channel, formerly apologetic coordination team, has been changed to simply agape (something) i remember the David Nathan fiasco when i first started watching Jacob’s videos, i didn’t have a lot of knowledge on the heresy he was promoting, i was only able to get to the 21 minute mark before i had to shut down the graham Baldwin video, it was so evident that this was a personal attack against Jacob, and he only showed portions of Jacob’s videos to promote his agenda without any context at all. It is incredibly disturbing that Sandy would post this deceiver on his YouTube channel. I really thought he was above this, apparently not. Thank you for the article brother. God bless

  18. carey says:

    I need to make a correction to my earlier comment, actually I’m not even sure if it got posted or not. So this might not even matter. In my previous comment I mentioned that I had just seen this video on Sandy Simpsons YouTube channel, and that the name of the channel had been changed, from Apologetics Coordination Team to, The Simply Agapee Project. I was so disturbed by this obvious hit job on Jacob Prasch, that I sent an email to Sandy asking him for clarification. Either from him or Mike Oppenheimer, as those are two of the faces I have come to trust and respect, due to their extensive videos on the N.A.R and the Word of Faith movement. Thankfully Sandy replied to my email and told me I was probably on Tim Wirths page. I honestly did not realize this at the time. and I really wish the comments on Tims page were not disabled, as I have quite a few words I would love to share with him! First off, it’s a bit hypocritical to call your page “The Simply Agape Project” when the videos he has posted from this Graham Baldwin character are absolutely not done in any form of agape love, in my opinion they are filled with hate, bitterness, and spite. just my few cents, for whatever it is worth. On a side note, thank you brother for your willingness to even go through these videos. I could barely endure 20 minutes of it. Not just with his obvious personal issues, and slander, but the man pauses so much your left there almost screaming, get to the point already! or maybe that’s just me. Still working on the patience part of my fruit! Anyway, may our God grant you peace and blessings, and thank you again for all that you do for the body of Christ

  19. Kathryn says:

    Joshua, since I have come alongside of your take on most things, listening to you for a few months now, what recommendations would you give to me if I were giving new believers some recommendations on resources besides the Bible, on where to go for correct teaching, such as ministries or a few good reads, or some leaders to follow, etc.?

    • Cristyl says:

      Kathryn. Im so happy you asked this questiin. I my self was looking for the same information. I pray for his responce.

  20. William Kruse says:

    I don’t know much about Moriel or Jacob but I have watched and enjoyed a few of your videos on YT, Josh.

    I came across this rather coincidentally, I was watching a video from a Gnostic(my presumption, it was about all religion being man-made) focusing on the Bible as a work of fiction. It centered on the KJV, and lo and behold he features Moriel in his video as evidence that the Bible is some sort of Freemason insider book. This led me to your site through a quick search.

    Moriel states the same on his blog, whether or not this is Jacob’s work is not known, no authorship is given. This is a pretty common tactic by those who hate the Bible. King James = Free Mason(though I’ve never seen evidence of this) therefore KJV = Book for Free Masons. Moriel does give a caveat that it still considers the KJV a valid translation, despite being “the Freemason Bible.”

    Despite the article on Moriel that modern translations are okay, I don’t buy it. There are verses missing, verses changed and some of them are pretty important. I personally do not use other translations, but I don’t fault others for using their preferred version as long they aren’t misconstruing important doctrine. Moriel calls being KJV only a cult. Is that a joke? Correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t a cult a Christian like religion that modifies the Godhead? There’s no context to imply that the use of the word cult is satire. This is not good, the best references to the Trinity are only found in the KJV, so I can’t help but chuckle at the irony. I choose to believe that the verses in 1 John are faithful and accurate. They are in the Greek translations but not all. This does not take into account that manuscripts available to the KJV translators are no longer in existence. We don’t know why the translators ultimately included the verses. I do know that modern editions chose to err on the side of removing a blatant reference to the Trinity, a move that surely would make Satan himself smile.

    There’s a reason that the Jesuits tried to blow up Parliament to prevent the KJ Bible translation. It’s still under attack today.

    Whatever your opinion is on the KJV only doctrine, King James being a Freemason is irrelevant and Antichrist servants take full advantage of this. For all I know, he might’ve been, so what? God uses evil for His purposes all the time.

    What is your stance on this? What is your opinion on the “Star of David?” Correct me if I’m wrong, but David didn’t have a star. Tangentially, Jesus could be considered the star of David, but that’s a stretch. Even if that was true, why would the modern nation of Israel put something that represents Jesus on their flag? We know how mainstream Jews feel about Jesus, that’s not a secret.

    I can’t see the star of David as anything but an occult symbol from Babylon. Between Moriel’s logo and their dubious content on King James, I’ve seen enough to know they’re bad news.

    I would be pretty shocked to know anything that I wrote was being used to “debunk the Bible.” I would also never under any circumstances use an occult symbol that is paraded by the people who brag about killing our savior. I won’t include some of the more gory details, but the writers of the Talmud had awful things to say about my Lord Jesus. These are one in the same with the people who put this symbol on their flag. If Moriel can’t provide some logical explanation as to how it is actually benign, then they can’t call themselves Christians without being blatantly hypocritical.

    I would love to hear your thoughts, but if you don’t respond I’ll interpret that as your sympathy with these matters.

  21. Sharon says:

    My heart is s sickened by these unfounded attacks on Jacob Prasch. They are quite frightening in their intent to harm without cause. They are truly evil and cause harm to the body of Christ because they sew confusion and doubt about a man who is truly sent by God to teach the truth and protect Christians. I have been praying for Jacob but these terrible lies about him warrant increase.

    The true men of God will be slandered and accused (which is a form of witchcraft) in the latter days. Mr. Prasch must feel the hurt of such outrageous allegations and the hate from which they stem. I pray God will protect him and keep his heart from being overly troubled. I rest in the knowledge that God will give him all the strength he needs to continue the true work of God.

    • grace says:

      greetings sharon,

      let us not be dismayed, let us be encouraged if a teacher whose teaching we have continuously prayerfully verified as truthful is attacked, the more vicious the attack, the greater our joy. jesus was maligned and finally crucified. we need to expect evil to always work against those who subscribe and live by the word of god. his attacks are directly proportional to the strength of commitment to live by god’s word.

      peace be with you,
      grace

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *